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Thread: IRAY SOFT EDGELESS MATERIALS - volume depht + 3d textures

  1. #11
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    Sep 2015
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    Quote Originally Posted by SOULSSAGA View Post
    [SIZE=4]
    We Already have the very best UBBER SKIN SHADER At the Market ...



    http://www.3dd.us
    http://soulsshine.deviantart.com
    http://facebook.com/soulsshine[/I]
    Sorry to have to say this, but the "N.G.S. Anagenessis" is the least physical based shader "on the market".

    - The color of the specular reflectance (Glossy Color) is some light Grey instead of a neutral RGB 255 White!
    - "Glossy Specular" is chromatic instead of monochrome, which makes the material a metal instead of a dielectric!
    - Wrong "Refraction Index" used, IOR 1.00 is a vaccum!
    - "Custom Curve" uses a wrong "Curve 0" (0.0; should be Fresnel Reflection at 0 degree, so around 0.04), a ridiculous "Curve 90" of 30.0 and 50.0 (has to be 1.0 max; a material can't at an incident angle of 90┬░reflect more light than it receives)!
    - Since the Iray Uber is based on the Fresnel-Schlick approximations, Curve Exponents of 3.0 / 15.0 are also wrong. The Exponent for Fresnel-Schlick is 5.00!
    - Transmission and Scattering values are based on wild (and out-of-range) guesses!

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by JanJordan View Post
    I noticed that the skin example i attached was actually missing part of the functionality. But as i said its wip.
    So, here is one that does what i described and a quick test using some DAZ assets. Again, no diffuse reflection, just sss and just 3 maps: specularity, bump and transmission color

    Attachment 8840
    Really nice render!
    No diffuse map? That's a very VRAM-friendly solution then.

    Browsing through your code: there's a "unit_conversion" multiplier of 0.005 used. I guess to get the distances from a meter to a centimeter scale?

  3. #13
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
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    IT is originally 0.01 and supposed to convert cm and m scale. but i misused it to adjust the overall translucency without changing the color balance between scattering and absorption.

    diffuse reflection is just a sss for very dense materials so originally i used it to get the color effect of dermal scattering. This is not necessary anymore so now i only would add diffuse if i want to simulate thick makeup (powder)

    i did not have time to finish the material, i think microstructure would add a lot. see also this interesting work on its effect: http://gl.ict.usc.edu/Research/SkinStretch/

  4. #14
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    Thanks, that explains why I got Insanely High™ coefficients when adjusting my calculation matrix. Looks like the People at DAZ 3D have ceased to change the scaling on their Iray plugin anytime it gets an update. Now they're using that 0.010 unit conversion on their Iray Uber too.

    Funnily, DAZ borrowed some of your material, the most recent Version uses a Dual Lobe Specular layer just similar to yours.

    If that's to mean you're working, or will work soon, on an implementation of microstructure deformation into Iray I'm deepley impressed.

  5. #15
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    We do talk with the DAZ devs the guys are awesome.
    they got the code too and i encourage them to use what they like.

  6. #16
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    Aug 2016
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    That Seams to Me "All Big Talk" ...

    But we Would Love to see Codes with "Better Results" .


    Last edited by SOULSSAGA; June 24th, 2017 at 09:48.

  7. #17
    Join Date
    Aug 2016
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    Default Full 30 layers physical skin simulation method in iray shaders





    HI EVERYONE !

    So in the Topic of more actions

    AFTER 1 YEAR AND HALF Of Development Research
    within MDL Language SHader Possibilities for a Large UBER PHYSICAL Skin Shader .

    I Leave here for the Ones Interested some Results .

    WITH A PAPER that EXPLAINS Step by STEP !

    The THESIS of our Biggest

    FULL 30 LAYERS PHYSICAL SKIN SIMULATION METHOD IN IRAY SHADERS

    30 SHADER LAYERS ! 17000 Lines of Code shader ...

    That we did For Research on Full Skin Development Techniques.

    And WHY 30 SHADER LAYERS ? ... Isnt that a Tremendous OVERKILL ?

    Yes it is : But for the THESIS And Development RESEARCH Result IT ACTUALLY WORKS !

    The Thing is that - We Been doing Research to see "how far could we take" Iray Shaders Mix & Overlays to make a "Complete" Skin Solution, that IN A SHADER tries to Mimmic Absolutely, all layers of Human Flesh and Skin From the Dozens Dermal Stratus to the Bone SImulation of Soft Scatering & Lightning Interactions Across Multiple Layers of Mediuns ...

    SO AFTER we SEE the RESULTS of The Higuest Possibilities ... Of having 30 Shaders Layers to make the Ultimate Skin Compound that Uses Absolutely All Every Possible SHADER Definitions there is in IRAY .


    ANd IRAY Handles it VERY WELL ...
    Even with 30 Layers Overlayed its not that Extremely slow
    only up to 4 times slower than common shaders .

    AFTER HAVING THIS MASSIVE EXPERIENCE DONE & CONDUCTED

    WE CAN THEN DEGRADE And Have just 4 or 5 Layers ...

    But Having the Stremely Important Visual & Development Tecnique Comparation with the "full thing"

    IN THE TIME we Developed the BIG 30 LAYERS SHADER Tecnique ...
    We Also Developed Other Tecniques ...

    What we call the FAST SKIN Method ...



    That are Actually very Good and Have Very good Results !
    BUT ARE HIGLY DEPENDEND ON MAPS To Look well ! ...

    Wille Our Goal With the 30 Layers Tecnique is to have a Half Good Looking Skin ...
    - WERE the MATERIAL MIMICKS How SKIN REACTS - WITHOUT MAPS ...

    And Just Feeding 1 SIngle DIfuse map and have All Lightning Reactions
    of the Many Stratus of Flesh Layers DO the rest in a Phisical Behaviour ..

    ...

    Of course that we could do this with just 5 Layers ! ...
    We can do this with Just BSDFS Instead of Whole Shader Layers ...

    ( WE SHOULD: If Iray didnt had that terrible Bsdfs Layers bug ... wich renders Material mixes to black ...)
    "The number of elemental BDSFs per material are currently restricted to a maximum of 6 levels."


    We Could even do the Same with Just 1 Shader and 5 Textures ...
    With Photoshop Compositing Style, Inside the shader ... to Drive Fake Looks ..

    There are Hundreds of ways of Simulating Skin Behaviours ...

    But we Actually needed to take IRAY SHADERS to the Maximun Full Possibilities ...
    So we can then COMPARE Other FAST SKIN Methods , with the Full Thing ..

    ...

    HOPE THIS THESIS HELP A BIT IRAY Shader Developers Out there to Have a Full Compreension
    To the Degree that we can and Sometimes Should take a Analistic Development for Research Purposes
    Otherwise the Product will always Lacking of Needing Qualities ...
    That Only Big Efforts in a Big Research does it ...

    ...

    This goes out to JAN JORDAN and expecially other MINIMALISTIC Iray Shader Developers there ...

    Yes there is Greath power in Being Minimalistic, Take Things simple & fast with Not So Bad Results

    But In a Proper Research : You Reaaly need to take THE EFFORTS to a Full Degree .
    So you can then REDUCE it to the ESSENTIALS , But keep the Same Full Look ...

    ...

    HOPE it clears A bit Up the FOG in this Tread of what for more than a year we been Researching at : )


    And HOPE NVIDEA IRAY DEVELOPMENT & CODERS take it AS A CHALENGE
    to Make their Shaders a Bit More INVOLVED With More Needed Qualities ...


    SHADER QUalities ... That we actually have and its alot more easy to work with
    in Other Renderers as Vray, Arnold, Even Cycles ...

    IRAY DEVELOPERS SHould start by Translating ALSHADERS Tecniques to IRAY ...

    http://www.anderslanglands.com/alshaders/index.html
    https://bitbucket.org/anderslangland...ders/wiki/Home


    And for that OF COURSE As iv been Exorting : we need much more than "SHader Mixing / overlaying" Tricks ...
    WE NEED First TO PASS Down the Engine Light Path Techniques that Are MENTAL RAY NATIVE

    And get Advancements on bidirectional surface scattering
    & reflectance distribution functions (BSSRDF) used for radiance transfer
    and Develop on new Gausian diffusion profiles to model multiple scattering Mixing.

    http://www.rombo.tools/romboskin/

    As today is quite DIficult for Users to do HYPER REALISTIC Proper Skin in IRAY ...
    And we Reaaly need to get Better Tecniques to Thin that out ..


    HOPE OUR Efforted RESEARCH Helps Enlight Some Of the Needed Keys Fundamentals
    In IRAY Layers Mixings for Proper Full Skin Emulations.


    CHEERS !

    THE 3DD.us TEAM

    PS: The EXample Bellow Use ONE SINGLE 4000px Bitmap for whole skin
    Use Always JUST DIFUSE no normals or bump or specular Maps aplied at all ...
    For better Naked SHADER Look dev debugs Purposes.


    TO NVIDEA TEAM : Thanks for watching / thanks for thinking on how to better it in Your SHaders in Next IRAYSkin WIPs .





    Last edited by SOULSSAGA; July 18th, 2017 at 03:27.

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